Since we started watching stuff like “Star Wars” and “The Jetsons,” we’ve all had curiosities about what kind of futuristic devices and gadgets will be available to us in our lifetime. We’re all surrouned by stuff in our daily lives that were just dreams when we were born, and now we currently take them for granted, such as whatever mechanism you possess that is allowing you to read this ramble. Those things are all good, to be sure. But there is still one biggie that I’ve always thought would be cool. You can take your flying cars. Let me have a teleporter.
Even now, teleportation seems to be a pipe dream that is a long way off. However, according to this article, scientists have sucessfully teleported beams of light from one side of a laboratory to another. Obviously, the science of removing the line between point A and point B is in its most rudimentary stage, dabbling with the most basic elements out there. However, what’s to say that breakthroughs in technology will prohibit such a device from fully crossing over from science fiction and science fact?
When I read this, I admit that I got a little excited. I mean, how cool would it be to be able to travel from Los Angeles to London in a blink of an eye? Suddenly, moving to Nebraska doesn’t seem like that bad of a proposition. However, I stumbled upon a discussion thread on teleportation (on Fark, of all places) that made me rethink my position of the coolness of teleportation.
You see, what essetially would happen in teleportation is that our atoms would be ripped up, be sent from point A to point B, and then perfectly reassembled. Now, the question you have to answer is this: Is the person that comes out at point B really you, or just a replica of you? You may have the same data-same eyes, weight, memories, skills-but is that stuff just replicated from your former being, which may have been ripped to death at the teleported origin? And for us religious types, where does the soul fit into all of this?
I have to go eat dinner now. Please feel free to discuss this. Let’s make this thread nice and long, gang.
July 11, 2005 at 8:10 pm
I don’t see any ethical problem with it. Think of it this way: the human body is constantly shedding old cells and replacing them with new ones. Skin, hair, blood, muscle, and nearly everything else breaks down and is replaced.
There are times that we intentionally destroy parts of the body. Cancer treatment, for example. All the white cells will be killed off and then replaced.
The cells that comprise your body today were not there ten years ago. Sure, it takes a lot longer than the few seconds a teleportation might take, but the end result is the same.
Teleportation would be scary because of the possiblity for a) accidents, and b) intentional tampering. Suppose the process was controlled by a computer which was infected with a virus or had been altered by a hacker. Or fell victim to a power surge, software glitch, or other abnormality?
What if, as a safeguard, the people who make these teleportation machines decide to clone you on the other end first, then eliminate the original. For a brief moment, there would be TWO of you. That’s the sort of thing that makes me go “hmmmm”.
July 11, 2005 at 9:33 pm
Ron hits upon the key issue with teleportation as an ethical issue. With cloning in the standard sense there are a whole plethora of ethical questoins, but what is not a question is whether the clone has any less of a soul than the original “parent.” In this standard cloning case, the soul of the clone is just as distinct as any other child conceived. However with the case of a clone by way of teleporation the issue is far more complicated with regard to the nature of the soul. Would the “clone” have a new soul and therefore be a new being entirely? And if you answer that question yes, would you then have to argue that the mere disassembly and reuion of the pattern of matter that makes up a person generate a new soul and in so doing create a new person? I am sure you are going to quickly say no, but what would then be the difference, other than the number of assembled person patterns, be with regard to the generation of a new soul? In other words, why would the soul remain with the first but not the second? So here you have the challenge. With the teleportation in a one to one sense the soul seems to pose no questions, but as we have seen on in Star Trek lore, there can be accidents and thus “cloning” of a kind, and thus the question of the teleportation of the soul becomes less than clear. As you can see I am only posing questions. I really and not sure of the answers at this point. I have a Star Trek Metaphysics book but have not read that yet. Maybe if this thread takes off, I will have to.
July 12, 2005 at 6:28 am
Just like Dave up yonder points out, the soul is awfully important. Where I get off Dave’s bus is when he says, “but what is not a question is whether the clone has any less of a soul than the original “parent.””
Here’s the problem. Teleportation, in the only way that seems feesible going down the current path of technology, requires that you disassemble a person, send data to the “reciever” telling it how many atoms to use, what kind of atoms to use, and how they fit together. It then assembles a copy. This is done by employing a quantam phenomena called “spooky action” which allows different atoms to share identical properties in a quantum state (which is not understood) over a distance. You are not moving the same atom from here to there. You just make a copy. Peep it, yo:
“Then, one ion from the pair – let’s say B – is entangled with A. The internal state of both these is then measured and the result sent to ion C. This transforms the quantum state of ion C into that created for A, destroying the original quantum state of A.” BBC
“Teleportation is the name given by science fiction writers to the feat of making an object or person disintegrate in one place while a perfect replica appears somewhere else.” IBM research
Nothing goes from here to there but a blue print. In effect, you kill the guy and make a copy somewhere else. Will God treat the original person like a regular old dead guy and endow the new one with a new soul? Every time we destroy the original and make a copy, will he kindly transfer our soul for us as easily as switching long distance carriers? Will the person on the other end be an automaton without a soul? Spooky action ineed. All we can manipulate is the physical stuff. Ultimately, the fate of the soul(s) is 100% unknowable to us in this situation. Besides, even if we could make an exact copy down to the last neuron, would memories and knowledge be transported as well or just the machinery?
Should we do it?
Here’s my plan if it’s ever my decision. Teleportation = cool. Teleport ‘em all let God sort ‘em out.
July 12, 2005 at 7:47 am
Actually Rich, it still makes moving to Nebraska look bad to me.
July 12, 2005 at 10:18 am
I’m worried less about the soul and more about the spread of epidemic diseases . . . even without teleportation, SARS can jump continents pretty quickly.
July 12, 2005 at 9:25 pm
Jason touched upon the one thing that makes the whole teleportation thing a scary proposition: Since, through quantum phenomena, the body at point A would be essentially destroyed, would that mean that point A person would die? Even if the transfer of memory and knowledge would take place, would that other person just be a non-mechanical version of a Blade Runner replicant? If I was to teleport to, say, Ireland for the day (a place I’ve wanted to visit), would I in essence not get the chance to see it because I unwittingly committed suicide?
I think it all comes down to the soul. If the soul transfers from one physical entity to another via teleportation, then everything is kosher. However, that is the great unknown, and no amount of scientific research is ever going to solve that mystery.
July 13, 2005 at 1:58 pm
I think that mystery could be solved actually. I don’t wanna take the time to Google this right now, but I seem to recall at least one study in which it was found that there was a mysterious change in a person’s weight when they died, something possibly attributed to the soul leaving… something like that. It was some kind of thing that said there was a miniscule physical change that could mean the soul left. So… perhaps we use hypersensitive scales to weigh the person before and immediately after teleportation. A change in weight would indicate the two scales not being synchronized or, possibly, something didn’t get teleported or “re-built” on the other side – the soul perhaps?
July 13, 2005 at 11:16 pm
No matter how you slice it, whether you’re “rebuilding” a person at the other end or not–you’re still killing a person. I dont know if I think there’s any “weight” to the soul-mass idea (pun intended) and who’s to say God will or wont “transfer” a soul from one point to another. It’s all good for high-minded consideration . . . but I wouldnt want to be the first one to step on that transporter pad.
July 13, 2005 at 11:25 pm
That’s exactly what I’m driving at, J. I’m sure that even if the scientific experiment that Jon is talking about does exist to the point where it could possibly show scientific evidence of the soul, you got to remember one crucial element: They are scientists, and they would most likely come up with a million other hypotheses before they would acknowledge the presence of a soul due to its spiritual nature.
All I know is, if this technology is given to us in our lifetime, it’s going to be fun to sit back and watch the philosophical and ethical debates that are sure to come out of it.
July 19, 2005 at 10:14 pm
Two words: “The Fly.”
Forget it, man. Count me out.